Yes I have to agree with Tom, on the East coast there are very few shops that I have spoke to that are not behind anywhere from %20 to %25 VS October 2007. Things will not get better until after the ( pick your poison) election, it may be well into next year before the consumer feels any better about where this country is headed. Hopefully this economy will not shed to many more jobs and some of the hardest hit industries start to recover, but until then hold on and button down the hatches and control your expenses. Unfortunately I just had to lay off my service writer and I don't for see needing anybody to next spring. Also I believe a big key during these times it to make sure you wrap your arms around your customers and stay in touch with them and they will be the ones to see us thru these trying times. Have faith it will get better!!